Problem Players Of A Different Sort
Everyone who has run a game has had them, and most of you have read about them. Yes, I refer to the problem players. Those people who make you wonder why you're doing it. There are plenty of articles about them, but we've read about those player types so much that we have it memorized. I've got three new types, and some of you at least have dealt with one or more of them.
Everyone who has run a game has had them, and most of you have read about them. Yes, I refer to the problem players. Those people who make you wonder why you're doing it. There are plenty of articles about them, but we've read about those player types so much that we have it memorized. I've got three new types, and some of you at least have dealt with one or more of them.
The Console Drone
To be fair, I have only met one of these people in my life. This person plays a lot of console rpgs, and likely hasn't ever done tabletop before. They probably heard you mention your game, and asked if they could join. Being the kind-hearted soul you are, you said yes. The good thing about these players is they have the absolute best of intentions, and after you deal with the problem, they can become great players. This player tends to disrupt the game, because he wants to be given options, just like a console rpg would give him. The way I found to deal with this problem is to take the player aside after a game and talk to them about it. Offer to do some one-on-one role playing sessions with them. After a few of these sessions they should get used to the concept. Give these players time and encouragement, and they can end up greatly enriching your game.
The ADD
(Not to be confused with D&D) - This player can be one of the most frustrating kinds of players to deal with. This player doesn't pay attention, and slows down the game when they have to ask you to describe the scene to them again. This player often engages in small talk with another player, and it may seem that no matter what you do, they just won't pay attention. This can be a difficult problem to solve, because it may be impossible to make the player believe they are doing anything wrong. Try taking the player aside after a game and explaining your frustration. Some of them will straighten up right then and there. For those who don't, move on to something more blunt. If they fail to pay attention during an action scene, give them a limited amount of time to respond when asked what their character will be doing this turn. If they don't respond, to bad for them, they don't get a turn. You can also give out bonus experience to the characters whose players can give you a summary of events, or something else that a person not paying attention wouldn't know. If all else fails, try some attention getters like, "The dragon eats you." That usually snaps people out of their trance.
The Personal Issues Player
This player can absolutely destroy a game, and even a gaming group. This type of player will often give you no warning they may be a problem player, and they may even add a good deal to a game before the problem begins to show up. This is the kind of player who brings their personal issues to the game. There are two basic varieties of this player: The ones who have a problem with another player, and the ones who have other personal issues. If the problem is between players and you notice the problem player is the only one who thinks there is a problem, take him or her aside after the game. Ask them what is wrong. After they tell you so-and-so is such-and-such, tell them they should talk to the person about it. Don't take sides. If the problem goes both ways between the players, pull them both aside and tell them you won't be taking sides and they can work it out or leave your game until they can get over it. It may seem harsh, but it is necessary. If a player has some personal problem, you have to be more tactful and compassionate if you want to keep them around. Be gentle, but firm. Tell the player they should not bring personal issues to the game. Quite a lot of the time, they will apologize and assure you it won't happen again. This will likely be the end of the problem. If it is not, you may want to ask them to sort out their personal life and take a break from the game for a while. You should still hang out with them, but don't let them ruin your game.
So there you have it, three problem players who aren't talked about very often. Join me next time for something else entirely.
- Login to post comments
I've met all of theese types.
The Console Drone is definately the easiest to deal with as they tend to catch on pretty quick that they have unlimited possibilities.
My entire group is the ADD, including myself, so I've found it's not a problem if everyone is like that.
The last Personal Problem player I had was the psycho-girlfriend of a friend of mine. The personal problem was she was crazy and nobody liked her. She was so disruptive that I had to actually kick her out of the game and tell her to not come back. And trust me, that's a drastic step for my group.
The console drone isn't always that easy to deal with. They do get over the fact that no one is going to give them a conversation tree to select paths from, but there are other problems they tend to have.
There are certain norms in console games. For example, after you kill the monster, you search it for treasure. If there's no treasure, you've been "cheated." It doesn't matter if the treasure is some crappy armor that's a fraction as good as what you've got, you can still take all 500 of them you've collected, stick them in your backpack, and carry them home to sell. The blacksmith will of course be delighted to pay for all of them, even if he's never made anything more complex than a horse shoe in the past. All enemies are beatable in a stand up fight. If the enemy is not beatable in a stand up fight, its because this fight is scripted and circumstances will force the enemy to leave before you're killed.
The worst part is when this type of player genuinely thinks they're good at tabletop roleplaying games. Then they're incorrigible, because anything you try to do to break them out of their rut is treated as offensive and unfair.
*I cast lightning bolt!*
*The enemy orc takes 15 damage, and dies. Orcs' turn. Three of the orcs charge you, and tackle you to the ground. Make a grappling check. Nope, no, that's not gonna do it. They've pinned you on the ground, and are slowly smothering you with their bulk.*
*WHAT???? They can't do that!!!"*
Whoever these people are, they haven't played many console RPGs. I've play console games where physical attacks do NOTHING.
My group learned the hard way not to under-estimate ANY opponent. We battle a small band of goblins, our group consisted of a giant lizard-man(club), a ranger(claymore), two elfs(archers), and a fire-wizard. In the end, the two elves were left standing; they were low on HP and were forced to draw their melee weapons (which they weren't good at) after running out of arrrows.
At first, Lizard-man was using the goblins as golf-balls. But he ignored his HP, and the gobbies ganged up on him. The goblins were just rolling better than us.
By far, the personal issues players are the most difficult to deal with. Firstly, bringing real life into a role-playing game IMMEDIATELY ruins the mood that a ST works to create. It's difficult to get back on track, even if the issue is resolved. Secondly, these players are often the least dependable. If they're offended, they'll often leave. Perhaps they'll come back the next time, maybe they won't, but what happens if this occurs in the middle of a scene? The character vanishes into thin air? Yes, you could NPC until the right time, but more often than not the player will not like this option. Also, there is the problem of a particularly stubborn issues person. This type will not leave. They will stay, and attempt to argue until voices are raised, names are called, and possibly, violence ensues. While this may not happen often, I've seen it. I've even had the problem in LARPing of a player attempting to sabotage the game after having conflict with other people, i.e. trying to get people to leave. Thirdly, real-world problems are much more difficult to resolve than in-game issues. I haven't found a good way around this, because issue players usually like role-playing, and will apologize eventually. It's a little heartless to keep them out. I have a particularly passionate friend who disrupts games occasionally this way. He always apologizes in the end, usually a day or two after, but his fury knows no bounds in the meantime. The one time I tried to kick him out for good, he listed all sorts of horrible things he would do if that happened, usually ending in the demise of the game. One hellish narrator. The advice in the article is exactly what I attempt to do when these situations arise: act levelly and compassionately, listening to the player's complaints, one-on-one if I have to. However, there is no way around a person who takes gaming too seriously, mixing it and real life.
Amen to this article. I had a console gamer in my last group. He was thoroughly obsessed with the final fantasy games. He was a great player at first, but he certainly suffered from the belief that everything was unfair. He also wanted everything to be just like the final fantasy games.
Have a whole group full of the personal issues ones now. Except that most of their squables change from adventure to adventure. One session they'll like player X, the next they'll hate the poor kid.
ADD. Have one now, and several that just act that way. Really not much of a problem, just be nice to them, and the rest will fall into place.
Thanks for writing this article, fallen angel. :-)
Thanks for all of the support. I hope that my future articles will be as useful as this one. Final Fantasy is a great series, but it has done some fairly awful things to most people's definition of role-playing. Thanks again. :-)
Got an ADD and the mother of all Personal Issues in the group I play in mIRC with now.
ADD is a pain in the rear, he shows up late, leaves early, sometimes misses sessions altogethher. The only reason he's still around is he's got about 4 years' tenure, and has not always been ADD. The last game he joined he was made to sign a contract (as all the players were) that he may have exactly 3 unexcused absences from the game, and any more will result in his permanent removal from that game, and all online games that GM is running. He's up to 3 now, and has been showing up lately, so we'll see how that goes.
Personal Issues is particularly disturbing for me. She's a good kid (er, young adult as of her b-day this year), creative and smart, but she is very manic-depressive, or is the correct term bi-polar now? When having an up day she is energetic as if Hasted to a factor of 5, on a low day she's convinced everything she does fails, and will often attempt to quit before she starts. This one definitely has the cat came back thing going - she left the group entirely for a period of nearly 2 years, then returned. What makes her particularly troublesome is that her character and mine years ago shared a lengthy romance, and she neglected to inform me that she takes her rp personally. I was in trouble for 'cheating' once when I moved in with someone in the real world, and again when my character became involved with an NPC after Personal Issues' character had been dead for quite some time. It is still held against me now and then. She has virtually no self-worth/esteem. Everything suggested in this article for dealing with that sort of player has failed, so some members of the group are trying a new tactic - pushing this person, and their character, into situations that are doable but difficult, and not giving her options to back out. Hopefully some hard-earned successes and the many MANY hours of talk about these issues, her weaknesses and strengths will inspire some growing up this player desperately needs. There's been some progress, she hasn't stormed out and demanded to be removed from all the group's games only to beg to be back in days later, in almost... 8 weeks, I think.
*dies*
Don't know what the point of that was really, guess I just needed to vent a little. Glad to know the group I'm with isn't alone with these particular types of problem gamers, though.
I feel your pain, Shaggs
I agree, the Personal Issues gamer is the toughest to deal with. I've come to accept that all of us (including me) bring a certain amount of baggage with us to the table, even if it's just in the form of having had a lousy week at work leading up to the session. Granted, it’s not to the extent some of the previous posts have mentioned (and I think we ALL feel your pain, Shaggs), but it can be a disrupting force anyway. I think the biggest lesson I’ve learned is to accept that it’s okay to miss a session if you’re just going to be a pain in the butt. It’s frustrating to be a player short, but I think it’s better than having someone there who’s really not in the mood to play.
Console Drones aren't a problem in my group, as ALL of us are Drones. Of the two games I'm currently running, one is videogame-inspired, and the other is anime-inspired. I make liberal use of conventions from the inspiration sources, so it works out fairly well.
ADD types wouldn't work in our group, as we play exclusively online... and if someone forgets to pay attention, they might as well have disconnected. As for people with personal problems... we've all got them, but we try hard not to let it affect the games. It usually works.
Just my two Gil. Er, cents.
Yeah,
I usually get AWAY from problems by gaming...
well, it helps...
I am also a console drone. Actually, I've evolved beyond that, I am now a console KING! Anyway, I've played every type of RPG imaginable, from Final Fantasy to Xenosaga to...uhh...*cough* Rhapsody.
I've used my experience with console RPGs as a way to improve my non-console gaming. I get more creative ideas...
Wow, that Personal Issues gal is pretty nutso. I think, sometimes if these things happen gradually, you don't quite get the full impact of how unsatisfying that whole scenario is - for anyone.
But writing it out like that, I hope you realize that it's a no-brainer. No game is worth that amount of real-life stress. Get out, get away, get away. Don't game with her. If she's part of the group, then quit the group. But don't game with her.
Point made there...
If you can't play nice, you don't get to play.
That's a great simplification Ass. The girl I had to throw out of my game didn't play nice. She was bitchy and rude to everyone and it just made the game no fun when she was around.
As an amusing aside. The game she was thrown out of was Mage. My friend Dan had a peice of paper that started fresh at the begining of each session and he would write Paradox Hell on it, every time she was overly obnoxious he would write a letter and he planned on when he wrote the whole thing he was going to take her aside and perform an excessively vulgar effect and blast her with paradox. He never spelled the whole thing out he would usually get up to 'Paradox He' or so. Other people would so often tell him to add a letter. It was classic Dan.
Another amusing aside. After she was kicked out of the group, things went smoother, obviously, but my girlfrind Emmi asked my friend Mica, the problem girl's boyfriend, if he had a wart removed or something. Then she realised that the problem girl just wasn't there anymore. That was classic Emmi.
heh...beauty.
That's right girlie...you TAKE your ball and you GO home! Its just a pity you buddy didn't get to use his secret 'Paradox Hell' attack...it would've been glorious.
Everyone except her knew about it and we were kinda sad he didn't get to. Were were more glad to have her gone however.
On another thread I talked about a man we will call "Jeff". He was another sort of problem player that hasn't really been touched on here. He was a cheating power gamer. If he didn't have the coolest character he wasn't happy and if something bad happened to his character he would either quit the game or conveniently loose his character. Once in a Hunter game my friend Dan and I couldn't figure out why he was so bad ass for a starting character so Dan took "Jeff"'s character sheet and discovered that he had gone over on his freebie points by 73! The next time we sat down to game I made him fix it. He stopped playing the next session so I wrote him out of the game.
As a total aside and shameless self plug I intended to turn that Hunter game into a novel when I ran it so I kept detailed notes. The title is Cities Of The Androscoggin: Vendetta and you can check some of it out at my website Random And Senseless (www.geocities.com/joshu_goudreau).
Everyone except her knew about it and we were kinda sad he didn't get to. Were were more glad to have her gone however.
On another thread I talked about a man we will call "Jeff". He was another sort of problem player that hasn't really been touched on here. He was a cheating power gamer. If he didn't have the coolest character he wasn't happy and if something bad happened to his character he would either quit the game or conveniently loose his character. Once in a Hunter game my friend Dan and I couldn't figure out why he was so bad ass for a starting character so Dan took "Jeff"'s character sheet and discovered that he had gone over on his freebie points by 73! The next time we sat down to game I made him fix it. He stopped playing the next session so I wrote him out of the game.
As a total aside and shameless self plug I intended to turn that Hunter game into a novel when I ran it so I kept detailed notes. The title is Cities Of The Androscoggin: Vendetta and you can check some of it out at my website Random And Senseless (www.geocities.com/joshua_goudreau).
That was only supposed to be one post, obviously. The URL on the second one is the correct one. Damn AOL.
My only suggestion is that you spiff up that site of yours with ...uhh...I dunno...pictures maybe? Its just a little too...green and black.
The mighty Ass has visited my humble website???????
Yeah, I know it's kinda boring. I was focusing a little more on content the how pretty it was. I think I will take some time to add some pics, that really is a good idea.
Yep...
I don't read the newspaper and even IT has pictures. So, I think a "dork-related" website, sportin "dork-related" pics would be just peachy. Maybe original artwork...or porn...whatever.
Or original porn?
I'm working on the site again now so it should be more interesting in a week or so.
Well...
Its been nearly a month and I saw...well...one picture...
Yeah, yeah, yeah. I know.
I need to get some time at a scanner which I havn't been able to do yet. That and I've been working on a site for my new game/game company.
www.geocities.com/project_16_home
There's lot's of pictures there. And frames too!
...and what game/game company would that be?
(maybe I should go look...duh)
Hmm...its a strange coincidence that your idea for a D20 system is very similar to the animated-screenplay I'm writing...
*Twilight Zone theme music in background*
Creeeeeeeeeeeepy.